Search for accuracy with my Henry

[Twotone]

Hi all,
After weeks of playing around and having my barrel recrowned, despite being a new rifle and still shooting like a scatter gun at 25 yds I was pretty despondent to say the least. Then last night I tried some copper plated 158 gn rnfp bullets over 16 gns Lil gun, the groups went from seven inches and shooting right by a foot at 25 yds to one inch group nearly central, would never have believed it.
Do not take this load by the way as an indicator, or try it out as I had no official load data save for one which said 16-18 gns with a jacketed bullet and so I tried 16 and flying by deat of the pants, it did feel hot. I have no idea at what the low end load I can safely use should be so any thoughts on that would be welcome, 15? Cannot find any other official load data anywhere without a jacketed bullet which I dont have and not sure how to convert the data from that to a plated bullet, any ideas??

[Hogstir]

Doesn't seem seem to be much loading data on that particular powder with cast bullets but the min charge with a jacketed bullet is 16gr and the max is 18.
Generally you would use a lower charge with cast bullets than with jacketed.
I'd drop the starting charge down at least 2 gr with a cast bullet.
Looking at H110 powder the min and max charge for cast 158 bullet is 2 grains less than for jacketed bullets.

[JEBar]

in your search for a bullet (specially a hunting bullet), keep in mind that most pistol/revolver bullets are designed and manufactured to operate at pistol/revolver velocities .... because of their longer barrel rifles usually generate considerably higher velocities, the bullet may not perform as needed .... during a search for the ammo that will be used, its wise look take that into consideration

[Hogstir]

in your search for a bullet (specially a hunting bullet), keep in mind that most pistol/revolver bullets are designed and manufactured to operate at pistol/revolver velocities .... because of their longer barrel rifles usually generate considerably higher velocities, the bullet may not perform as needed .... during a search for the ammo that will be used, its wise look take that into consideration

Very good point. I use gas checked cast bullets due to the velocity attained in my rifle. Most cast bullets are not designed for the velocities we get from rifles and thus need a gascheck to prevent leading problems and poor performance.

[ssonb]

Have you tried a lighter bullet? 125 gr...I only did a quick read you may have..The rifiling twist to bullet length, velocity and diameter may be the culprit in lead, or try the same weight bullet in a copper clad or jacket.

[Hogstir]

Have you tried a lighter bullet? 125 gr...I only did a quick read you may have..The rifiling twist to bullet length, velocity and diameter may be the culprit in lead, or try the same weight bullet in a copper clad or jacket.

If I remember correctly from another thread he is in the U.K. and they are not allowed to use any expanding bullets, only lead or FMJs. That means he cannot use jacketed bullets.

[ssonb]

Copper clad as in Electroplated...Jacket as in FMJ, much thicker.

[Hogstir]

Copper clad as in Electroplated...Jacket as in FMJ, much thicker.

Berrys bullets has a warning on their plated bullets not to exceed 1250fps. You'd have to be shooting light 38 loads to stay below that velocity.

[Twotone]

Thanks everyone, been away a few days with no internet, just saw the replies. I will reduce my loads in lil gun and try some cast bullets to see how they go, the plated bullets with 15-16 gns grouped better than anything up to now but there is a big difference in cost here.
At least the rifle is approaching what it should be, the different powder made a huge difference, would not have believed it possible .

[ssonb]

I load all my 44 mag rounds to 1125 rifle and thru a pistol 950 fps .. 8.0 gr of Unique The rifle velocity hits point of aim at 75 yards..now these are play plinking loads fer huntin they would be a might stiffer.

[clovishound]

Have you tried a lighter bullet? 125 gr...I only did a quick read you may have..The rifiling twist to bullet length, velocity and diameter may be the culprit in lead, or try the same weight bullet in a copper clad or jacket.

If I remember correctly from another thread he is in the U.K. and they are not allowed to use any expanding bullets, only lead or FMJs. That means he cannot use jacketed bullets.

FMJs are jacketed. You can have jacketed hollow points/soft points (expanding), or jacketed round nose (non expanding). Most times FMJ is used to refer to round nose jacketed.

As to velocities and plated, many plated manufacturers offer heavy plated versions that can handle speeds up to 1500 fps. Even using the 1200 max versions, if you look at the data for .357 rifle on Hogdgon's website, some of the faster powders have start and even max velocities under 1200. Powders include Titegroup, Universal, HP38, 700x.

I use plated, or coated 158 grain bullets in my .357 Big Boy Steel. Right now I'm using a mid range load of Universal. I get good accuracy up to 25 yds (max distance at the range we use). Good accuracy being one ragged hole.

For maximum accuracy, I have found jacketed bullets over a mid load of 4227 gives me a small increase in accuracy.

[Twotone]

Hi guys
In the last few weeks there has been a change in the law here that means we can now use expanding ammo for target shooting if we can find it for the .357!
I have found a great increase in accuracy recently using 16 gns lil gun with a plated 158 gn bullet, still experimenting though.

[clovishound]

Well, I doubt that you will find an increase in accuracy using expanding ammo over a similar type of non expanding. Still, more options are a good thing. I use Xtreme plated hollow point bullets for my target loads, not because it is a hollow point, but because it is capable of 1500 fps velocities vs 1200 for their other bullets of the same caliber. In .357 out of the Henry rifle, not having to worry about limiting MV to 1200 gives me more flexibility.

[Twotone]

At the range the last two nights , i found a mint condition Marlin scope from the sixties and thought great, then found the rings wont fit so now on a search for 3/4" rings to fit weaver base ha ha.
Anyway, shot therefore using iron sights again using the plated rnfp bullets under 16.2 gns lil gun, i now have groups not patterns and no longer shooting to the right. Really happy now , ALL WITHIN 1.5" at 25 yds ,the powder seems to have made a huge difference . Being new to all this I would never have believed it . Just practice now, thanks everyone for all the great advice, sure is a learning curve,

[JEBar]

delighted to hear that things are working out .... looking forward to your continued reports

[Hogstir]

At the range the last two nights , i found a mint condition Marlin scope from the sixties and thought great, then found the rings wont fit so now on a search for 3/4" rings to fit weaver base ha ha.
Anyway, shot therefore using iron sights again using the plated rnfp bullets under 16.2 gns lil gun, i now have groups not patterns and no longer shooting to the right. Really happy now , ALL WITHIN 1.5" at 25 yds ,the powder seems to have made a huge difference . Being new to all this I would never have believed it . Just practice now, thanks everyone for all the great advice, sure is a learning curve,

You could use a set of 1" rings and ring reducers.

http://www.brownells.com/optics-mountin ... 18588.aspx