Maximum Cartridge OAL

[Oldguy44]

I have an H010 45-70 that I absolutely love. I have been reloading 405 grain gas checked lead and 350 grain JRN for some time. Recently I ran into a situation with the jacketed round nose bullets that spooked me a little. Without getting into too much boring detail, does anyone know what the maximum overall cartridge length is that an H010 can digest? Most reloading guides suggest 2.550 but there are some loadings that result in a longer OAL.
Thanks

[BigAl52]

One way you can find out as I find Henrys vary from model to model is build a dummy round with the length of the bullet you are looking at and see if it will cycle in your gun.

[Vaquero]

Yes as Al said they vary even in the same models as we have come to find out on our own.
Al and I have a 41 BBS each, and both were among the first 250 produced and ours are quite different.
Mine will cycle cartridges up to 1.69, and Al's won't.
Now my 44 BBB will only cycle rounds up to 1.63, wish it would cycle a longer round.

RP

[JEBar]

Al's suggestion is a solid one .... with our Henry 45-70 I load Nosler bullets and set the loading die to where the end of the case is in the bullet's crimp ring .... have done the same thing with several other brands and weights of bullets .... they've all performed as they should .... be sure to follow the link below and add your Henry rifles to our community's total


http://henryrifleforums.com/viewtopic.p ... 93#p123393

[Ojaileveraction]

Some round nose configurations (Hornady?) Can be a little long in some chambers.
I've bought a Hornady OAL gauge and a modified case for all the cartridges I reload. That way I can get measurements and have a better idea of what is happening.
OAL in lever gun is also dependent on how/if the round cycles thru the receiver.

[Vaquero]

OAL in lever gun is also dependent on how/if the round cycles thru the receiver.

That's it, but why are the chambers deeper than what will cycle through the gun
I can single load my BBB 44 mag with an OAL of 1.71, but the rifle will only rounds up to 1.63.
Don't make any since, you know it has to affect accuracy,
as there's the gap from leaving the case to the jump before it hits the rifling.

Then you have the inconsistency in even the same firearm in same caliber.
Like I mentioned about Al and my 41's.

RP

[Ojaileveraction]

Then you have the inconsistency in even the same firearm in same caliber.
Like I mentioned about Al and my 41's.

That's why an OAL gauge is handy.
I'm not altogether sure jam or jump in a Lever Gun (no turn chambers) is going to make a significant difference in accuracy. Statistically maybe.

[Oldguy44]

Thanks guys for the comments. I actually have done exactly as suggested. Here's the back story: I was reloading with Hornady 350 Grn JRN and
IMR4064 making incremental increases but still well within the suggested loading guidelines. I noted that the last two rounds measured .030 longer than the suggested 2.550 max and 2.580 was all I could get as the bullet was compressing the powder. So I dropped them into the tube and cycled the first round which seemed to have an ever so slight drag, but that could have been me being hesitant. The second round cycled slick as snot. After some pondering on the subject however, I decided I didn't want to force a potential self inflicted bad result, so I took them apart and reduced the charge by a few grains to 55.5. That allowed the bullet to seat in the middle of the cannelure for an OAL of 2.550. Chicken I guess but safe. I think what pushed me over the cliff was that the case was right at the edge of the cannelure. In the future if I think I need more oomph I can switch powders to something like IMR4198.
Frank

[Ojaileveraction]

seemed to have an ever so slight drag, but that could have been me being hesitant

That slight drag could be the tip of the bullet hitting the top of the magtube as the lifter picks it up.
Check the bullet tip for marks.

[BigAl52]

Thanks guys for the comments. I actually have done exactly as suggested. Here's the back story: I was reloading with Hornady 350 Grn JRN and
IMR4064 making incremental increases but still well within the suggested loading guidelines. I noted that the last two rounds measured .030 longer than the suggested 2.550 max and 2.580 was all I could get as the bullet was compressing the powder. So I dropped them into the tube and cycled the first round which seemed to have an ever so slight drag, but that could have been me being hesitant. The second round cycled slick as snot. After some pondering on the subject however, I decided I didn't want to force a potential self inflicted bad result, so I took them apart and reduced the charge by a few grains to 55.5. That allowed the bullet to seat in the middle of the cannelure for an OAL of 2.550. Chicken I guess but safe. I think what pushed me over the cliff was that the case was right at the edge of the cannelure. In the future if I think I need more oomph I can switch powders to something like IMR4198.
Frank

Try some Reloader 7 I shoot that same bullet in mine with RL7 and it works great.

[Vaquero]

Then you have the inconsistency in even the same firearm in same caliber.
Like I mentioned about Al and my 41's.

That's why an OAL gauge is handy.
I'm not altogether sure jam or jump in a Lever Gun (no turn chambers) is going to make a significant difference in accuracy. Statistically maybe.

I have never used much less even seen an OAL gauge.
how does that determined what will cycle in a particle firearm.

RP

[6MT]

You would be better served with a case length guage. Lee makes them for most calibers. Loading cases long to get the bullet closer to the lands for accuracy is a recipe for disaster for cycling reliability in most lever action rifles.

[6MT]

One way you can find out as I find Henrys vary from model to model is build a dummy round with the length of the bullet you are looking at and see if it will cycle in your gun.

This is the very first thing I did when I decided to load the .44mag round. I made a perfect pilot round with an OAL of 1.601". It cycled perfectly in my new rifle. I then proceeded to load them all exactly the same.

Documented here: http://henryrifleforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=8217

[Oldguy44]

Would anyone like to comment on the necessity/importance of the case sitting in the middle of a cannelure of a finished round? On a smooth bullet like a gas checked lead RN it's not an issue, only if it will cycle in your gun. Those bullets tend to be pretty long so you'll run out of room before running out of grip. The 350 JRNs are a bit shorter so is crimping short of the cannelure going to be appropriate if you're up against the powder assuming it cycles of course.

[BigAl52]

Never found that to be a factor. As along as the crimp falls inside the cannelure Ive shot them.

[Ojaileveraction]

I have never used much less even seen an OAL gauge.
how does that determined what will cycle in a particle firearm.

It can't, it just measures how long your chamber is.

Would anyone like to comment on the necessity/importance of the case sitting in the middle of a cannelure of a finished round

I try to crimp at the forward edge of the cannelure. As light as possible.
Same if there no cannelure, very light crimp.

[Vaquero]

I have never used much less even seen an OAL gauge.
how does that determined what will cycle in a particle firearm.

It can't, it just measures how long your chamber is. "Quote"







What good is that?
Like my 44 it'll chamber a 1.71 length round, hell maybe longer I hadn't tried, but
the rifle won't cycle it.

So it's Useless.

Back to this question.
Why cut the chamber that deep if the firearm won't cycle that round?

RP

[Ojaileveraction]

I'm just talking about measuring things, the why's and wherefores of things are above my pay grade dude.

[Vaquero]

I'm just talking about measuring things, the why's and wherefores of things are above my pay grade dude.

Lol.

RP

[Ojaileveraction]

Any ways I think Oldguy44 is taking about compressed loads more than OAL.
My Hodgdon data has a(Lever Gun Section) Max Load of IMR4064 as compress .
That's a very stiff 2000+ fps.
Not what I shoot.
Tried a box of Reminton 350 at 1800+ fps when I first got my 45-70.
My teeth are still loose.