Henry Rifle Forums

I recently had a second case (Nickel Plated) split and leave the front half in the
Chamber of my Henry Big Boy .44 Magnum Rifle.

Couldn't get it out with the old oversized barrel brush technique or a 'pick', so I developed
(or invented) a SPLIT CASE REMOVER for myself.

I had posted it on another Forum (where my handle is "Martini-Shooter") before I could get on THIS forum.
I just found out about THIS FORUM from a fellow on a local gun trading site.
http://www.spokaneguntrader.com/viewtop ... 9&t=103200

Was trying to find out why the old Henryfirearms.org site was unresponsive.
The owner vanished....as it were.

Have a look: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... ry-Big-Boy

It looks like very few folk are interested in it. Otherwise I might have tried to have it made
by someone.

DoctorBill
Eastern Washington State area

Welcome from the Show-Me-State, DoctorBill.
You'll find the owners here are doing a great job, and do plan to stick around!
Enjoy your visits to the Forums.

Welcome and thanks!

I find this topic to be fascinating .... we've been firing and reloading large numbers of 44 mags since the mid 60's .... I honestly have no clue how many tens of thousands of rounds that has included, we've fired over 300 in the last 8 days .... we've had numbers of cases to split but never had one to separate and leave part of the casing in the chamber ....

Nickle plated brass splits super fast . I'm not going to go into why but you can look it up on the internet . The fix is easy just do not use nickle plated brass . The way you resize the brass and a Lyman M-die keep you from over work the brass . Most people over crimp and there brass because is not all the same length . I've use this brass for 16 yrs and loaded over 90 times and used in 4 different guns in SASS/CAS matches and practice without single failure . I never annealed the brass ever either . I got 500 new Remy piece of brass to replace the original brass if I ever got a failure 13 yrs ago . The still new

I did something similar in the seventies to get the front half of a case out of a Navy Arms 1866 in .38 special. I just took a bolt , turned down the head and cut self taping slots in the end after turning down the diameter slightly.
i took out the bolt and used a screwdriver slot cut in the bolt head to tighten it into the brass stuck in the barrel.
after that a few taps with a hardwood dowel and out she came. The rifle is now a wall hanger and that's why I don't like toggle link leverguns. The head separation was from a factory load.

Travlin wrote: The rifle is now a wall hanger and that's why I don't like toggle link leverguns. The head separation was from a factory load.

The toggle system was design for low pressure black powder ammo . The 1892 Winc was design high pressure smokeless powder . I know over 20 people in SASS that shoot 38 special in a 1866 and shoot a 1000 a month in them for 10 yrs or so with no problem . But 60% of them roll there own ammo too . Would you be interested selling it . If so pics and price please I think Uberti made most of them for Navy Arms .

Thanks for the offer TX. The rifle feeds and ejects loaded rounds fine. I loaded up so very mild 158 gr. round nosed ammo for it. It would not extract the fired shell which was easily picked out with my fingernail. So I think there is an extractor issue. I would not feel right selling it knowing it has that issue. I know that type of action is favored by the CAS .bunch because of the straight line feed.

Welcome from CT, DoctorBill. You've started an interesting discussion.

And, I agree with tx gunrunner

tx gunrunner wrote:Nickle plated brass splits super fast.

Early on, I had three Remington nickel plated cases from the same batch that split at the rim after three reloads. Since then, I only use them for sub-sonic lead loads with a gentle crimp, and so far, so good.

Travlin wrote:Thanks for the offer TX. The rifle feeds and ejects loaded rounds fine. I loaded up so very mild 158 gr. round nosed ammo for it. It would not extract the fired shell which was easily picked out with my fingernail. So I think there is an extractor issue. I would not feel right selling it knowing it has that issue. I know that type of action is favored by the CAS .bunch because of the straight line feed.

I'm a gunsmith so I can fix it . The extraction problem is normally a loose screw or not adjust correctly . ...... The straight wall cartridge works best in the toggle system because of that straight feed . That is one reason why I have a 73 is for 38 spec [ below ] . This is the 1st and only target I shot at 50 yds with this gun .

I've seen nickle brass split on 1st firing .....

Are nickel plated brass problematic? I just bought 100 Starline nickel brass. I thought it would be a good way to keep from mixing up my Ruger only loads I use in my Henry from the standard loads I use in my Colt replicas.
I use the standard brass for my Ruger only loads.

Nice shooting. The last three shots with my 1866 were with nickel plated Remington brass. The third shot was the head separation. Back then I was young and could see and shoot a lot better than today. We had a hundred yard rifle range about fifteen minutes from my home. The Remington ammo was 125 grain hollow point which of course should not have been shot in a toggle action. Out of three shots at 100 yards , two were touching. I should have known better than shoot that stuff but I hear that someone has a toggle rifle chambered in .44 magnum. I won't shoot it. I always shot Federal 158 grain round nosed ammo in the navy arms rifle and it worked fine. I know those actions are O.A.L. sensitive I guess that's why it wouldn't feed the S.W.C. loads in .38 cases that I used in my Colt Trooper. Once again thanks for the offer but the rifle is not exactly like the newer ones ie no catch for the lever.

OK....I have NEVER heard the term "Toggle Rifle" before.

What does that mean ? Is that like that odd mechanism of a Luger Pistol ?

Is that type of mechanism in my Henry Big Boy .44 Remington Magnum Rifle ?

DoctorBill

DoctorBill wrote:OK....I have NEVER heard the term "Toggle Rifle" before.

What does that mean ? Is that like that odd mechanism of a Luger Pistol ?

Is that type of mechanism in my Henry Big Boy .44 Remington Magnum Rifle ?

DoctorBill

This is a good video on the toggle system . This should answer all you questions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuBw1ieYZD4

So that "Toggle Action" is supposedly not very strong when firing powerful rounds, right ?



If all that hardened metal is essentially jammed closed, how can it open even with a high powered cartridge.
It would have to bend or break those hardened metal levers that are held in a straight line by the lever.

I have a friend who says that the .303 British Enfield has a weak bolt (one lug) - have any of these
rifles had an officially acceptable, Documented instance of a bolt coming loose when
fired in Battery ?

Otherwise all this is just like the Media does - innuendo and blah blah to frighten us natives.....
I'm not trying to be a wise ass, but I prefer recorded, direct PROOF over people's opinions.

A great deal of things are said or implied that are never substantiated with actual proof.

I have not had my Henry Big Boy .44 Magnum apart yet - does it work just like in the YouTube video ?

DoctorBill

This is where the 73 Winc bolt breaks when you Hot Rod them . That is why the 92 Winc was designed for high pressure ammo . Both Remy and Winc made 44-40 HV and on the box it said not to shoot it in a 1866 or 1873 rifle or Colt pistol . The pic below is a Uberti 73 with modern steel but there is no meat there for high pressure stuff . ............. They put reline on auto engine RPM for a reason remember that .

tx gunrunner, Thanks for posting the excellent info of the weak spot in a toggle action levergun. That picture "is" worth a thousand words. A lot of the younger shooters will be saved a lot of grief and possible injury .

The 66 or 73 will shoot 1,000,000 rds without breaking if not Hot Rodded . There is no better action for be smooth and fast . It is the choice of most champion shooters and jim in video sell all the part to make race guns out of a 66 or 73 . This short video should make a better shooter out of you . Watch both videos . Shooting 10 rounds in under 3 seconds . I hope these video help you shoot better and it not speeded up like a AD on TV .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VY3dTX3aF7o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNtmbTh7J_s

Thanks for the links. I agree that as long as you keep them under the "red line" the will go on without any trouble.I only wish that I had not had a bad case of young and learned earlier in life.

I've watched those shooting videos dozens of times and have practiced it hours on end. It really will make a better shooter out of you.